Serious thread: alcohol related

[ident]

Just curious. Not really the type of place to ask a question about this. but i thought there are so many open minded people here. not to mention sensible lol. any way

 

has any one ever had to help some one with alcohol? im not on about myself lol.

 

just a friend of mine(yes it really is a friend) has a serious problem with it. but every time i mention it i get loads of abuse. Swearing shouting. I AINT GOT A PROBLEM. but some one who drinks EVERY DAY. 10/15 pints has. Not to mention they work for me and turn up late.

 

My question is how did you help them? The guy is a great worker for me and a close mate. but he needs help. How can you help some one who dont want to help them self?

 

sorry if personal threads cant be talked bout

[tcoffeep]

Easiest way to put it : You can't help them until they realize they have a problem. I speak from personal experience.

[DennisD]

No problem with the topic, but you do have a really difficult problem with your friend.

 

It's always a balancing act I believe, to mix business and friendship.

 

Being a friend and an employer can I believe sometimes bring you to the crossroads of deciding which you have to put first, and maybe a first step would be making it clear to him in a tactful way that his conduct is taking advantage of your friendship.

 

If he could be made to recognize himself that his drinking and timekeeping are coming close to abusing that friendship, then it might be a first step toward him recognizing himself that his drinking is a problem.

 

The most difficult thing is getting the admission that a problem actually exists.

 

Of course, helping your friend can't be your responsibility alone. It has to be shared by all the people close to him.

 

Do I know what I'm talking about here? Yes I do sadly. A close relative of mine had a life threatening drink problem many years ago after failing to come to terms with civilian life after leaving the Army.

 

We had a problem making other family members believe the problem was even there. So good luck to you, you could have an uphill battle ahead of you.

[morricono83]

Hello,i'm new here.Everyone a good evening or a good morning.If you have a problem with alcohol,be honest with yourself and recognize that there is a

problem.Alone,it isn't possible to stop.You need proffesional treatment.In the beginning,it's hard,but you need

perseverance,and it is it worth.Be leave me.

[Jamin4u]

If a person wants to stop the insanity, they have a chance to succeed.

 

One usually has to hit a personal rock bottom to reach out for help.

 

Here's one thing you may want to consider.

 

When family, friends, and associates of a chemically dependent individual allow that individual to continue the addiction to alcohol or drugs, their behavior is called enabling. When repeated, enabling behaviors become ingrained in the chemically dependent person's family, job, or social structures.

 

Meaning Well: The Origins of Enabling

We often begin enabling in an attempt to be kind and helpful. For example, we may wake someone so they are not late to work. By doing so, we help them avoid the consequences of oversleeping because they were using or drinking late into the night before. We loan addicts money, often over and over again, and we are surprised when they use it to buy more drugs or alcohol.

 

Enablers may have their own system of denial that is fed by the lies and deceptions addicts use to cover up their using.

 

The Effects of Enabling

As enabling behaviors become routine, we end up feeling frustrated, ineffectual, and angry. Often, we continue to enable because we don't want to appear mean or unreasonable. Enabling behaviors directly and indirectly support the vicious cycle of never-ending problems and pain of addiction. When we stop enabling, when we stop helping and covering up for the addict, we allow the addict to experience the consequences of their out-of-control behavior. We no longer wake them up, loan them money, or bail them out of jail. We stop shielding them from the consequences of their behaviors.

[aqua]

well i know this from the past,,from a cousin..is true,the law says "you can not force an alcoholic" to get medicl attention.

but,,a lawyer told me you can do something,the nearest relative can get you a something like a permission,power of attorney in relation to the alcoholic prson..

the reason=,,since alcoholic is a sick person,"many times" they don't realize what they do,,they're a serious thread for thenselves,for kids,for elderly at home,even in the street..they can even commit suicide or murder under the effects of this legal subastance...they suffer from depression.

in that case you can force him to take a treatment,,in some cases doctors put then to sleep for like 1 month,and then the detox program..

these person need lot of help,believe me..

and alcohlic is the peron who needs alcohol for any "ocassion",,bithdays,parties,etc..

hope you can do the best for your friend.

[Robbie]

well i know this from the past,,from a cousin..is true,the law says "you can not force an alcoholic" to get medicl attention.

but,,a lawyer told me you can do something,the nearest relative can get you a something like a permission,power of attorney in relation to the alcoholic prson..

the reason=,,since alcoholic is a sick person,"many times" they don't realize what they do,,they're a serious thread for thenselves,for kids,for elderly at home,even in the street..they can even commit suicide or murder under the effects of this legal subastance...they suffer from depression.

in that case you can force him to take a treatment,,in some cases doctors put then to sleep for like 1 month,and then the detox program..

these person need lot of help,believe me..

and alcohlic is the peron who needs alcohol for any "ocassion",,bithdays,parties,etc..

hope you can do the best for your friend.

Unfortunately for the original poster who has concerns for his friend (as he is in the UK) you can't force anyone to take treatment unless the person is "sectioned", that is held under the relevant provisions (sections) of the Mental Health Act 1983.

 

Here's a brief outline of what this entails:

 

http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/DisabledPeople...alth/DG_4014771

 

Whilst people who drink to excess or take drugs can sometimes be a danger to themselves or to others, unless they are in imminent danger of harming themselves or others then there's little that can be done, except on a voluntary basis. If they are in imminent danger then a close relative (or the person his or herself) can phone the police or emergency services who can take the person to a place of safety whilst awaiting a medical examination by a relevant Doctor. Normally the person would be taken to a police station or a hospital. Then a decision can be made under the terms of the above Act to "section" the person if needed. But most, in fact the vast, majority of people who abuse alcohol will not end up in such a situation. Arrested maybe, but for being drunk rather than for anything else.

 

From my experience of people with serious alcohol problems, it is a downward spiral that unless checked can involve loss of jobs, friends, partners, the house and in most cases the certainty of serious health problems. However, unless the person concerned is willing to make the first move (to acknowledge there is a problem in the first place) then no solution may ever be forthcoming. Some people sadly will eventually just drink themselves to death - I know people who have done this and there's nothing you can do if the person themselves doesn't want to do anything, unless their mental health does deteriorate to the extent where they can be sectioned against their will. If the person acknowledges there is a problem and wants to do something about it then they can start to get better with the right treatment.

[Robbie]

Just curious. Not really the type of place to ask a question about this. but i thought there are so many open minded people here. not to mention sensible lol. any way

 

has any one ever had to help some one with alcohol? im not on about myself lol.

 

just a friend of mine(yes it really is a friend) has a serious problem with it. but every time i mention it i get loads of abuse. Swearing shouting. I AINT GOT A PROBLEM. but some one who drinks EVERY DAY. 10/15 pints has. Not to mention they work for me and turn up late.

 

My question is how did you help them? The guy is a great worker for me and a close mate. but he needs help. How can you help some one who dont want to help them self?

 

sorry if personal threads cant be talked bout

You've got two interlinked problems here that must put you in a very awkward position. The guy is your friend and rightly you want to help in anyway that you can, although your friend doesn't seem to even acknowledge there is a problem (and drinking 10 to 15 pints of alcohol every day is a sure sign of a very serious problem). But he is also your employee and this must put you in a position where he is abusing not only your friendship but also your trust (as his employer) as he probably isn't being very efficient if he is turning up late and perhaps causing other problems too - maybe not pulling his weight when he is there?

 

It's a dilemma I wouldn't want to have to face but somewhere down the line if he doesn't face up to his problems then you may have no option but to decide whether he can be both your friend AND your employee. Sorry if that isn't helpful but it is inevitable if things continue as they are. For the friend part you can only be there for him if he is prepared to accept he has a problem, as you have seen you can't force him to stop drinking and if you did he would probably become resentful and argumentative - the power of denial. For the other part, the employer / employee relationship side of things, that one is tougher still.

 

Good luck, hopefully your friend will eventually realise he has a serious problem and realise that he has people who are concerned and care about him and that he takes positive steps to do something about it.

[aqua]

they don't realiza,,that's the problem.,they're under severe depression.

[hazelnut]

I follow along the lines of Robbie here. You are an employer and you have a duty to your job and family that the job supports including yourself.

 

He is also your friend. Talking to him (as his employer) and telling him the bottom line here can sometimes be the best thing a friend can do.

 

Either he will take steps on what you have said, or he will leave your employment and embark on his next path of downward spiral until he reaches the point where something has to give.

 

Sometimes you just have to accept that it is not you who will make the difference, and the wisdom to recognise that.

 

Personal experience here also.

[Andavari]

I can't stand alcoholics one bit and have absolutely zero patience when dealing with them, and that goes for druggies too.

 

Seems like from the info in this topic that in the UK it's super difficult to get rid of an alcoholic or drug abuser, here in the U.S. they could easily be fired just for being late however some employers over here offer treatment as a last course to save the persons job, and if it's denied the person is on their own left to rot in their own misery without a job to fuel their substance abuse.

 

He seriously needs treatment, but until the day and moment arrives that he realizes he has a serious problem that will take his full wits to battle I don't think there's much that can be done.

[wmcintosh]

First off; I am an alcoholic.

 

They have to want help, do not force it.

[Corona]

I photally underphtand.