Hi Derek. I've tried every option in Macrium to no avail. I even tried a different freeware cloning program but it wasn't as good as Macrium. The only thing I haven't tried are the "Advanced Options" in Macrium. I don't understand those. Any ideas?
Hello Brad - Glad to see you're still hanging in there. Sorry to hear things aren't working out for you. I took a look at the Advanced section, on the next attempt you might want to try three things: Exclude VSS writers, Enable file write caching, and Ignore bad sectors.
Before you try the above, I want you to try one thing. Plug in the Toshiba and take a look at the contents of the drive. See if C: and Recovery are actually there. Then click C: and check to see if all your system folders are there. It should look exactly the same as what is on your hard drive. If not, then something went wrong in the cloning process.
Did you try using different settings in BIOS for the boot order? The Toshiba might not be detected as a USB Hard Drive, but as another USB device. Try using anything related to USB, whether it's usb hard drive, usb cd-rom, usb dvd-rom, or simply usb device. Anything mentioning USB.
If all of this fails, I am thinking that it comes down to one of three things: Your BIOS does not recognize the Toshiba as a bootable device, the Toshiba was never designed to be a bootable device, or there is no master boot record installed in the first part of the drive. You won't be able to do anything about the first two items, but you might be able to fix the third. Let me see what I can come up with to check if this is the case and what to do to fix it.
Also, in your next post, give me the model name and/or model number for the Toshiba, and for the Asus motherboard as well. I want to visit their websites to see if I can find anything that will help at this point. Are you beginning to see why I came up with plan B? Sometimes things don't go exactly as you planned, and you have to have a way out.
The Recovery portion is there and appears as the same GB size. BIOS is fine. The Toshiba boots to the Microsoft "Starting Windows" screen with the animated logo but goes no further.(computer restarts before logo animation is fully finished) The Toshiba does this with the bad hard drive unplugged. So I would say the Toshiba is bootable. The Toshiba does this whether or not the Recovery partition was cloned along with C: partition. I'll try the Advanced Settings u mentioned.
boots to the Microsoft "Starting Windows" screen with the animated logo but goes no further.(computer restarts before logo animation is fully finished)
If your original System HDD was in perfect health but CONSISTENTLY misfired on startup due to software corruption,
I would expect a perfect clone to behave in exactly the same fashion.
Since your original System HDD was NOT in perfect health,
Were its recent start ups always consistent ?
If not I would expect a perfect clone to consistently start-up with the whatever original HDD problems happened to be captured at the time of cloning.
Good point Alan. Do you think opening a command prompt and running "sfc /scannow" would reveal any missing system files and fix them? Might be worth trying before attempting another clone.
Sorry but I have no relevant and good experience of SFC.
It never worked for me on an old XP Laptop because it insisted upon using installations disks - which were never supplied by Dixons - a store that also sells television sets.
It I think that SFC /Scannow sounds like a reasonable and quick repair option.
Personally I have never used clones.
I always used Images which avoid any danger of the cloned disk powering up and crashing as a result of the presence of two disks with identical Signatures,
Though I think I recently read that Macrium no longer makes a precisely identical clone but tweaks the Disk signature to avoid such problems.
The only chaotic restoration that I experience was when I thought I could "Dual Boot" without using the official techniques.
After a fresh install of Windows 7 on a new to me SSD,
the previous installation remain available on a primary HDD, along with other applications in other partitions.
One day I used the BIOS controls to force booting from the 100 MB partition of the HDD.
instead of the default of booting from the 100 MB partition on the SSD.
I successfully launched the HDD 100 MB boot code,
BUT unfortunately instead of transferring control to the 25 MB partition C:\ on the HDD,
it stumbled into the 55 MB partition C:\ on the SSD.
All I knew at first was that Windows was not working as I expected.
Drive Letter C:\ gave me no clue of what was wrong, but having an extra 30 GB of free space pointed me in the correct direction.
I recognise that for the current problem the Toshiba HDD does not see the bad HDD so that sort of chaos does not apply,
but from my experience I found that the Macrium Recovery CD has options to fix the MBR and any other strange start-up issues when a restoration fails.
It is possible that this might be able to deal with clone failures in addition to restoration failures.
Regards
Alan
My boot with the bad hard drive has been consistent. At the beginning of the boot, the SMART detects the bad drive. I have to press the F1 button to continue. Windows always starts fine.
Hi Brad.
I think that D: partition is or was the recovery partition, built in to allow a system recovery from within the computer. If it has a bunch of files with extensions like .ini, .sys, or .inf that’s what it is.
If Alan & Derek can't get you fixed, the built in recovery system might still be worth a try.
If you bought this computer new and made the recovery disks, you maybe can use them to reinstall the OS to a new HDD.
If you did not make them you may still be able to. You can only do that once per machine. Long shot, but worth a try.
If your HDD is failing, you'll have to get another anyway, and those disks will get your computer up and running with a new HDD.
This link tells how to make them (see "Method Two" about half way down), also tells how to use the built in recovery partition if it's still working. The instructions are for a laptop, but they're worth a try.
http://support.asus.com/Troubleshooting/detail.aspx?SLanguage=en&m=G73Sw&os=&no=1775
Here are 3 other links telling how to access the recovery partition if it is still working.
http://forums.majorgeeks.com/showthread.php?t=96388 http://en.kioskea.net/faq/26463-asus-laptops-accessing-the-recovery-partition http://www.w7forums.com/threads/windows-7-recovery-partition.4534/
Here is a link with a phone number to contact Asus in case you need to buy a set of recovery disks.
http://us.estore.asus.com/index.php?l=page_view&p=contact_us
I had a laptop that displayed the disk failing warning for several months. I just backed up the data and let it go until it failed completely, then had a small local shop put in a new HDD and reinstall win 7. Cost about $200.00. Worked out OK, but if it hadn't I would have still had the recovery disks to put it back to square one.
Without screen-shots of Windows Disk Management we are flying blind,
but I suggest that any partition other than C:\ (e.g. Recovery partition or D:\ etc.) could be almost as important as C:\
My Acer Windows XP Laptop had many partitions on its solitary HDD.
A partition table accident happened and I had zero partitions - no boot, no nada.
Minitool Partition Wizard Boot Recovery CD fixed things for me.
Initially it allowed me to select all previous partitions, but totally failed to restore any.
By trial and error I found the first 6 partitions could be restored if I abandoned the last one.
I had not used the last partition for a couple of years so was happy to discard it.
I restored all partitions - BUT IT STILL FAILED TO BOOT.
Then I realised that getting an external HDD for Acronis Partition Image backups was the reason I had stopped using the small Acronis "Secure Zone" for that purpose,
BUT it was possibly still involved in the startup of Windows.
I then used Minitool Partition Wizard Boot Recovery CD to "Repair MBR" and avoid dependence upon the absent "Secure Zone" partition,
and then Windows booted o.k.
Hard experience suggests that Windows may stutter and give grief when it cannot find special partitions that appear of little use.
Had almost the same experience with an Acer. Fixing MBR fixed the booting issue.
But, it doesn't appear that Brad has a booting issue, rather a failing HDD. The HDD is from 2009, not old enough to have worn out yet, but who knows?
And he apparently has his stuff backed up now. So maybe the next step is to devise a way to get the Factory OS running on a new HDD.
I could be wrong about that, but it is the approach I would take if the computer is worth saving.
It is was me I would just download the Win7 iso and use my key from the bottom of the machine to give myself a nice new, bloat free, Win 7 install.
I think a recap of everything done so far is needed so everyone is on the same page. Brad has found some bad sectors on his current internal 1TB drive, but it still works for now. This drive has the following partitions:
1.) Recovery - NTFS Primary - 8.01GB, 5.65GB used
2.) C: Win 7 - NTFS Primary (Active) - 280GB, 50.6 used
3.) Unallocated - resulting from shrinking C: from it's original size
4.) D: data - NTFS Primary - 550GB, 252.8 used
Brad stated he does not have the resources for a new hard drive and does not have Windows 7 Home Premium 64 bit installation media, but has a valid activation key from a sticker inside the case. He has two external Toshiba 320GB USB drives available to him, and early in the process he had copied the contents of D: partition, his data files, to one of these drives. The original plan has two parts, and one is completed. Brad has downloaded a copy of the Windows 7 ISO and installed it to a USB stick using Rufus. He has tested it, it boots, and prompts him to start installation. This was a backup plan in case the other plan failed.
That plan was to copy his current operating system to the second Toshiba and allow him to keep using his computer until he can get a new internal drive. I suggested using Macrium Reflect to clone both the Recovery partition and C: partition to the Toshiba, as well as clone the contents of the Toshiba to the replacement hard drive when it is available. So far this has failed, because the Toshiba will not boot to Windows. So he is not completely dead in the water. His old drive continues to work, and the USB stick is available if he wants to do a fresh install on his new drive. I was only concerned about his old drive failing and leaving him without the use of his computer, and that is why I devised a two part plan. So that is where we stand now, if any member can add to this, I'm sure it will be appreciated.
It seems like like a good idea. Working with a malfunctioning hard drive is a recipe for utter disaster. Also it's a very good thing he had already done some backups.
PS - Also, don't you think this thread should be moved somewhere else. Hardware section maybe?
It is was me I would just download the Win7 iso and use my key from the bottom of the machine to give myself a nice new, bloat free, Win 7 install.
Yes, me too. Best advice, imho. That would be the way to go.
But I'm not sure Brad would be confident to do that. It's kind of intimidating, imho.
A hopefully relevant question:
When one does that, how does one get all the drivers right for that particular machine?
I ask on behalf of Brad and me too. Only done it once, it was not straightforward.
It is was me I would just download the Win7 iso and use my key from the bottom of the machine to give myself a nice new, bloat free, Win 7 install.
.
Usually (iirc) this won't work as the disc isn't OEM but the number probably is
@ Derek
Thank you very much for a concise summary that has brought me up to speed without causing pain or the need for more than one cup of coffee
Although I have read this topic several times when it was only 1 page,
and occasionally re-read when it became two pages,
there are details I have not remembered,
Questions :-
Are the Toshiba drives USB2 or USB3 ?
Is there any chance that they are connected to USB3 ports ?
If so perhaps there would be better success plugging into a USB2 port for a slow boot rather than fast fail.
Because I suspect you might need Win8 compatible Hardware and Firmware / BIOS before you can boot via USB3 hardware.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
BIG QUESTION :-
How about running Chkdsk on partition D:\ to simply test whether this has bad sectors ?
If the basic mechanism is good and the only problem is with some specific sectors in C:\,
then Data partitions may still be good because they are not driven as hard and degraded as much by Windows thrashing the life out of C:\
1.) Recovery - NTFS Primary - 8.01GB, 5.65GB used2.) C: Win 7 - NTFS Primary (Active) - 280GB, 50.6 used
3.) Unallocated - resulting from shrinking C: from it's original size
4.) D: data - NTFS Primary - 550GB, 252.8 used
One detail you forgot to include and which I need and found in post #21
"3. Completely blank 75.61 GB (created when I shrank C:)"
SUGGESTION based on the above, especially assuming that D:\ has no bad sectors :-
At each stage below, test as advised and DO NOT PROCEED with anything following a failure until that failure is fixed.
First of all you you need to have downloaded and created a working Minitool Boot Recovery CD in-case anything goes wrong
http://www.partitionwizard.com/partition-wizard-bootable-cd.html
1. Make a Macrium Partition Image backup of C:\ :- you can never have too many backups;
2. Make a Macrium Partition Image backup of D:\ :- you can never have too many backups;
3. Shrink Partition D:\ to about 260 GB, leaving above it 290 GB Unallocated;
4. Restore the partition D:\ image to fill up this 290 GB of space as a new LOGICAL (Not Primary) partition;
You should now have two partitions with nothing much to distinguish them,
probably D:\ at 260 GB and E:\ with 290 GB (252.8 Used);
5. Change the 260 GB partition to X:\ and then change the 290 GB partition to D:\;
6. Make sure that you still have full access to all your Data files in the restored 290 GB partition D:\;
7. Shut down and restart and make sure that you still have full access to all your Data files in the restored 290 GB partition D:\;
8. Delete the 260 GB partition X:\, which should increase Unallocated space from 75.61 GB to 335.61 GB;
9. Restore your C:\ backup into a new and smaller PRIMARY partition within this extra space, using a size of at least 60 GB - but I suggest 100 GB for future needs,
and leaving Unallocated the first 100 GB, much of which may have been thrashed to death when occupied by C:\ before it was shrunk,
and also leaving a subsequent Unallocated space of perhaps 175 GB to 135 GB for future use as required;
10. Shut down and restart and ensure everything looks good, with C:\ occupying 280 GB near the beginning of the Disk;
Followed by some other drive letter for the restored backup that follows the first 100 GB of unallocated space;
11. Change the System Volume Name of the new 100 GB Partition
(Linux tools such as Minitool Boot Recovery are not aware of drive letters, and even WinPE Boot tools can allocate the WRONG letters to partitions,
so I like to ensure that each of my partitions has a name which not only reminds me of its purpose in life,
but also includes a prefix or postfix such as _C_ or _D_ etc etc.)
12. Cancel the ACTIVE flag that is set for the 280 GB partition C:\, and make Active the newly restored 100 GB partition with the different System Volume Name.
13. Take a deep breath and prepare for the worst (some people cross their fingers, I am helped by a fervent prayer)
14. Shut down and power up and thank God for a successful outcome,
or failing that the Minitool Boot CD should cancel the Active Flag from the 100 GB partition and make Active the 280 GB partition,
and then shutdown and power up and you should be back to the same condition before you implemented stage 12 - i.e. no harm done other than a waste of time.
15. Assuming full success,
Expand the 280 GB partition back to its original size of 356 GB, Change the System Volume Name to "WORN-OUT-BAD-CLUSTERS", and remove its drive letter;
16. Shut down and power up and make sure that everything is in order.
The above should avoid the Bad Clusters that were previously affecting C:\,
and may give you a new partition C:\ that is in much better health,
and will avoid problems of the Hardware / Bios capability to Boot a USB2/USB3 Toshiba Drive.
Please note, you should be able to run CHKDSK perhaps 3 times faster on a 100 GB partition than on a 280 GB or 336 GB partition,
and searching for lost / deleted files would also be 3 times faster
and Wiping Free Space could be 5 or 6 times faster.
I STRONGLY RECOMMEND
that my suggestions should NOT be actioned immediately but that you wait for comments by others with greater and wider experience than myself.
@ Derek - I am especially looking at you
I have ALWAYS been able to recover from any disaster that was not my fault, and any inconvenience due to my overlooking of a vital precaution,
but I have only done this in the few cases that arose on my own system that was under my total control.
If anything goes wrong with stages 1 to 14 then I am afraid that fixing a problem via forum posts is not so easy.
Regards
Alan
I don't like to suggest something I have not actually done myself. And I have not done these things.
But . . .
According to the links below, you can activate windows if you have the product ID number from the sticker and download the correct ISO for whichever version you already have (home, Pro, Ultimate, etc).
Fwiw, windows magically keeps track of the hardware on your computer, and if you don't change too many devices too quickly you need not reactivate. It might be that Brad will not have to. And if he does, at most it requires a phone call. I know that to be so.
Also, I can't help but think that even if Brad completes the processes suggested here, he will still have a questionable hard drive, which might fail soon. Less grief to just get a new one and install win 7 clean.
pretty good http://pcsupport.about.com/od/windows7/a/install-windows-7-usb.htm long, tedious, thorough: http://pcsupport.about.com/od/operatingsystems/ss/windows-7-clean-install-part-1.htm win 7 forums for clean reinstall OEM brink http://www.sevenforums.com/tutorials/1649-clean-install-windows-7-a.html win 7 forums for clean reinstall OEM gregrocker http://www.sevenforums.com/tutorials/219487-clean-reinstall-factory-oem-windows-7-a.html microsoft how to, good http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/activate-windows#1TC=windows-7 windows activation FAQ: http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/activating-windows-faq#1TC=windows-7
login I have clean installed machines using the downloaded Win7 SP1 iso quite a few times. As long as you have the sticker number it is legal.
As for drivers before you do the install, download the ethernet and wireless drivers from the computer makers website and stick them on a cd (plus any others you feel you may need later).
Windows will provide quite a few of the needed drivers when you do the first updates but obviously you have to have the 'ability to get online' drivers installed first which is why you stick them on a cd or usb stick first.
If Windows says to phone Microsoft about activation I have never known a refusal by them personally
Sometimes you just have to bite the bullet. A new hardrive and a new Win 7 install is the way to go I would think in this case.
I thank all of you for your input on this topic. I have just finished reading this thread in it's entirety for the second time today, and have gone back to some of the bookmarks I have made while researching and planning what to do. I came up with the plan I described with three objectives: First, to use the hardware Brad has available to him. Second, to allow him to continue using his machine if the hard drive failed. Third, keeping the whole process simple to understand. At the time, and according to what I read, cloning seemed to be the easier to understand and to use. I also read that the master boot record was copied as a part of the cloning process. It seemed ideal for what I was trying to accomplish. Perhaps I have put too much faith in using the cloning process versus the imaging process, it's hard to say with all the variables involved. So now, what to do and where to go from here.
In reply to Hazelnut, Nergal, and login123, I did a lot of reading prior to having Brad download and prepare the Windows 7 ISO in order to do a clean install. I believe the images from Digital River are made available for three reasons: 1.) For people who have a valid activation key but have lost their installation media. 2.) For people who wish to do a clean install of Windows minus the factory installed bloatware. 3.) For people who have had a hard drive failure and have lost the recovery partition along with it. In the event that the activation key is not accepted online, it is a matter of calling Microsoft and explaining the situation to a representative. In the event it is an OEM key, I have read that they will accept it as long as it is a valid key from a COA label. The disadvantage here is that any software or drivers that are on an OEM recovery disk are absent and are your responsibility to install. Also, the manufacturer may or may not honor any warranty claims in this situation. In Brad's case, this does not apply to his 2009 machine. If anyone disagrees with this, or has something to add, please speak up now. Also, I read just this evening that these images will not be available to download after March 2014, that is when the contract between Microsoft and Digital River expires and is not being renewed.
In reply to Alan, I always respect your ideas and opinions regarding what will work and what will not. And I know you put a lot of time and effort into your post. I had to read it twice, the second time very slowly. It is a good idea as far as getting the data away from the bad sectors and onto the less used part of the drive, provided that is where the problem exists. But it is complex, something I have tried to avoid so far. If you were doing it yourself, then you would probably have no problem, because you fully understand it. But you're not the one doing it. And using Mini Tool Partition Wizard is like a double edged sword: powerful in the right hands and hazardous to the inexperienced. One slip could be fatal. All along I have tried to keep this as simple as I could, but maybe your plan should be considered if Brad understands it and feels comfortable trying it.
A very good question in regards to the USB ports being used and the Toshiba. Brad will have to look into this, it is something only he can answer.
I'm glad you brought up using chkdsk, it is something that has been bothering me. Are the bad sectors located in Recovery or C: or D:? Or all three? We have no idea. If they are in C:, it might be the reason the cloned image has begun to boot then failed, except this contradicts the fact the hard drive itself continues to boot. I realize I advised Brad not to do it if he thought it was putting the drive at risk of failing, but now think it is something that must be done first, before going any further. Also, running sfc /scannow would reveal if any system files are missing or corrupted, and restore them from the .cab files. If these two things are not done, then any further effort to image or clone C: is a waste of time.
There is one other thing I considered, but it also depends on where the bad sectors are located. If the Recovery partition has no bad sectors, isn't that all that would be needed to do a clean install? Especially if C: is riddled with bad sectors or corrupted files, is it worth saving? Maybe imaging or cloning that one partition is the simplest and easiest thing to do, I don't really know at this point, just throwing the idea out there. It's late here, and maybe I'm not thinking too clearly, I'll read this again tomorrow and see if it makes sense.
Edit: I had no idea Hazelnut posted while I was typing this, I'm glad she agrees with me concerning the activation process, even though it makes a large part of this post look redundant.
Edit #2: I just realized Alan has reached 4000 posts and Hazelnut has reached 12000. Congratulations!
Just to clarify things regarding the legality of downloading and using the Digital River iso files. They are linked to by Microsoft itself
I would strongly advise anyone who uses Win 7 to download the iso of their version of Win 7 while Microsoft is still hosting it. Not only is it good for clean installs without 3rd party software bloat, the disk can also be used when the machine won't boot to do repairs to the OS and other things.
A very handy thing to have indeed.