RunAmok

One more clue, for whatever it's worth.... I just cleaned out %temp% (which, by the way, CCleaner does NOT clean out) before I shut down for the night. There were 36 files (some zero byte, some not) and 4 empty directories (2 of which were subdirectories under one of the top-level 2 directories). I checked to see that they all were in the recycle bin (they were) and then clicked the 'Run CCleaner" link. When it finished, the recycle bin's icon still showed it had contents but opening it showed it was empty. The interesting part is that when I then manually tried to empty it with the recycle bin's Empty link, it asked if I wanted to delete 4 items - accounting for the 4 folders which I'd just seen in there, but not the 36 files. Sooo.... if there's only one folder to start with, it asks if you want to delete one item which it describes as "Windows" but if there's more than one folder, it simply asks if you want to delete the number of items which were originally folders... Files get deleted normally and don't add to the wierdness count. Go figure....

Based on years as a Windows admin, I'd bet that it's not really an 'invisible' file that's being left behind - since I can't see anything in the actual file system using either Windows Explorer or several lower level utilities. My guess is that it's some long standing Windows bug - from as far back as W98, according to the reports - which misinterprets whatever (?) it's finding and pumps out the "Are you sure you want to delete 'Windows'?" message. Since I don't have a clue how CCleaner empties the recycle bin, I don't know where else to look. Registry? Some entry that's set to flag the fact that a recycle bin is populated - which is no longer getting cleared? Something in the file system or specifically in the properties or contents of the recycler folders on one or both drives? In any case, your suggestion reminded me that I don't really know how long it was before this problem popped up when I actually deleted a folder so it could have begun several CCleaner releases back. Ahhhh ... Here's another set of clues which may help someone figure it out: 10.1525 - Works as expected 11.1541 - Fails 11.1550 - Fails 12.1572 - Fails All tests were done using the 'quick and easy' method by creating a new folder on the desktop, dragging it to the recycle bin, right-clicking the recycle bin and selecting the "Run CCleaner" option, noticing that the icon did not revert to the 'empty' icon (and the "delete Windows" message still resulted from a manual empty) and continuing to really 'empty' the recycle bin for the next test. And as I said, now that I know that continuing to manually empty the recycle bin after the misleading message doesn't really delete "Windows" it's not really that big a deal. Probably scares the crap out of the average user though... <smile> Hopefully, the dev's will figure out what they changed between 3.10.1525 and 3.11.1541. And I'd love to find out what's actually causing the problem - and the misleading message.

Those two links were on point, although they were circa 2006 and slanted toward how to recreate the recycle bin under SP2 or discussing the same invisible "Windows" file/folder as far back as W98. I compared the .reg file with my registry and found several differences but I think those were more SP3 or local config oriented rather than part of the problem. And while I'm willing to add the symtoms of an invisible "Windows" in the recycle bin to the long list of Windows Wierdness, the bottom line is that this had never happened here until I upgraded to the 3.11.1550 release. Neither do I know why XP claims that whatever it sees is "Windows", but Microsoft is Microsoft and wierdness is wierdness... Still, it got my curiosity up, so I did the volume copies that I'd been putting off this month, recreated the problem, and emptied the recycle bin which claimed it was about to permanently erase "Windows". I don't know what it erased or what or where it changed something, but the end result appears to be nothing more than an empty recycle bin. I'm permanently set to view system and hidden files, but there was no change in any of the recycler properties or contents (or lack of contents) that I could see. I did some additional testing to see if there was some specific environment or recycle bin contents which contribute to the problem. Tried large and small files on both drives (but nothing bigger than the allowed space), folders (empty, populated, renamed, etc), all with using just the Recycle Bin's 'Empty" link and then again using CC's "Run CCleaner" option in the Recycle Bin's options. Bottom line is that deleting files on either (or both) drives works as expected with either method but CC leaves something (?) behind if there's a folder involved - although using the Empty option works as advertised. The folder is deleted, but Windows sitll thinks there's something there to be handled. And whatever got left behind can safely be deleted/repaired by just using the Empty option. Oh, and I do have the two drives set to individual percent of allowed space since they're different sizes and one is relatively small (20% of 500Gb $ 10% of 40Gb) so they both have their own recycler structure.

Interesing thought, but.... the folder was created my simply right-clicking on the desktop and picking 'new folder' I just didn't bother to rename it. And the same symptoms occur when I delete any unwanted file. CCleaner deletes everything in the recycle bin, but leaves behind something invisible it refers to as "Windows". It appears from the two systems I have here that the problem only appears on the system with two hard drives. Both are otherwise identical, XP, Pentium 4HT, loaded apps, file system and structure (give or take an individual file or two), etc.

Thanks for the reply. Should have tried that, but because Windows seemed to think that "Windows" - whatever that meant - was a candidate for deleting, I hadn't pursued it any farther. But if there was something corrupt in the Recycler of either or both of my hard drives, that sounds like a reasonable next step. I did delete the Recycler folder on both hard drives and reboot. Sure enough both were recreated with a single folder (my id) under both, and I could put things in them and manually empty them with no problems . Soooo... I repeated the test outlined above, simply creating a folder on the desktop, dragging it into the recycle bin, and running Ccleaner from the recycle bin icon's right click options again. Back to square one! Again, the Recycle Bin icon still shows it has contents, nothing there when I 'open' the recycle bin or in either recycler folder or subfolder, but again asked if I want to delete "Windows" if I try the Empty The Recycle Bin choice. Appears to me that this version of Ccleaner apparently creates some kind of corruption in one - or both - of the recycler folders on my two hard drives.

Take-two: I just reproduced the same problem. Created a new - empty and unnamed - folder on the desktop and dragged it into the Recycle bin. Used the Recycle bin's icon option to run CCleaner - which appeared to run normally. At that point, the symptoms matched those described above - except that my memory must have been slightly off since when I click on the Empty Recycle Bin choice it asks if I want to delete "Windows". Again the recycle bin appears empty from any method I can think of using to look at it, CCleaner does not see it as populated from an analyze, but the icon shows it still contains something.

Running CCleaner 3.11.1550 under XP SP3 did something rather strange the first time I ran it. Using the Run CCleaner from the Recycle bin icon, it evidently tried to clean it but the icon didn't change - still showing that the recycle bin had some files in it. When I opened the recycle bin at that point it did appear empty. But the "Empty the Recycle Bin" choice from the Recycle Bin icon was not greyed out. When I tried that, it asked if I wanted to permanently delete "Window". That was a bit scary, so I didn't proceed. I checked the Recycle Bin using Windows Explorer (I'm set to view hidden and system files) and it appeared empty. A manual 'analyze' run of CCleaner did not show the recycle bin so it evidently thought it was empty. The next day, I deleted some files, and manually emptied the Recycle Bin. From that point on, CCleaner seems to be working as I expect it to - deleting anything in the Recycle Bin and the icon changes from 'not empty' to 'empty'.

I could buy that and even happily embrace that... since it would suggest that a 'stronger and more agressive' CCleaner might have found the real problem in my registry instead of all the symptoms of that problem CCleaner now finds. And if I didn't have two almost identical PC's with the same XP, same apps loaded, and almost mirror copies of data files, I might have had an easier time tryng to figure out what -and when, and why- things went south. CCleaner in One PC began to find what it thinks are hundreds of problems, for reasons I'm still trying to discover, and continues to run as it always has in the other. In looking back over what I wrote, I dawned on me that I told my story of what happened but didn't really ask the question I needed and wanted to: I'd bet that something made one (or a very small number) of changes in the registry, or perhaps in the file system, which made CCleaner think it needed to 'fix' the huge number of entries it now thinks are errors. But those registry entires CCleaner now finds are apparently valid - and severely cripple Windows if removed. Since I don't have an in-depth knowlege of the registry, all I have to work with is the save CCleaner did before I let it 'fix' what it found, and several older full regsave files. Someone better trained and experienced than I am might be able to discover what all those CCleaner save entries have in common, or what missing or damaged between an old regsave and a current regsave, but... that's way above my head. It might, however, be nice for a CCleaner designer/programmer to know why it failed the way it did - especially since there is obviously some problem with my registry. I'd attach the CCleaner save file here, but it's an 8Mb file. And of course, the full save file is over 100Mb.

I've used CCleaner for five or six years; maybe too many since I've obviously become complacent although it's worked just as I expected ever since I first installed it. I run the /auto every night, and occasionally ran the Registry cleaner when the sprit moved me or I'd installed or uninstalled a program. But a week or so ago, the registry function found hundreds of things it didn't like - even though the computer appeared to be running and working normally. I let it 'fix' the 'problems' it found - did I mention I'd become complacent? - (after telling it to do a backup) and immediately found that many basic functions no longer worked. Internal file types such as .msc, .bat, .scf, were "Unknown file type", even from the run command line, and a few of the application software associated files types I tried such as .xls were no longer associated. A reboot didn't help. So, proceeding on "What's the last thing you changed?", I restored using CCleaner to restore what it had removed, and rebooted again. At that point, most things seemed to be working normally again (and still are), but... IE7 would load but never display anything but a blank page and wouldn't let me change the URL to browse. Luckily FireFox worked normally. After trying to figure out what might be causing IE7's blank page problem - and failing - I finally uninstalled IE7 (which dropped me back to IE6), downloaded and reinstalled IE7, and that problem was fixed. But there are now two sites that IE7 can access but FireFox can't - standard non-descriptive error message with no details about why a login fails. I've checked all my cookies, (and flash cookies), compared my IE7 and FF settings with my other computer which has continued to work normally, updated from 3.07 to 3.08 when it notified me that the update was available, but... a registry scan still finds the same huge list of 'bad' things if I scan with Missing Shared DLL's, Unused File Extensions, or ActiveX and Class Issues checked. Almost all of the 'bad' entries it finds have something to do with HKCR, but I don't have a clue what started this whole mess other than a vague suspicion that the last time I ran a registry scan was before the last patch Tuesday. In any case, CCleaner appears to mistakenly find errors when the system is working normally, and the restore from a CCleaner save does not appear to have fully restored what it 'fixed'. XP Pro, SP3, patched up to date. And to anticipate the question, both McAfee and MBAM say my system is clean.